The Heretiks (2026)

Hold your ears folks it's. Showtime people pay good money to see this movie when they go out to a theater they want cold sodas hot popcorn and no monsters in the projection. Booth everyone pretend podcasting isn't boring turn. It off. Hey folks, welcome to a special episode of The Projection Booth.

I'm your host, Mike White. On this episode, I am talking with the director and many of the cast members of the new film, Heretics. It is a new folk horror film where a disaffected teenage girl has to team up with a renegade witch to protect her little sister from a murderous coven determined to use her as a human sacrifice. Yes, I know I said coven. Because coven sounds like oven.

I had a great time talking with Greg Bishop, director, Josie Juliette Vert, Tess Williams, and Kimberly Epstein all about this film. Very effective horror film. I hope you have a chance to see it soon, and I hope you enjoy this interview. Enjoy. Greg, I want to know a little bit about you.

How'd you get into filmmaking, sir? I found my dad's old film camera when I was like seven years old in the attic. I was like, oh, wow, I could be making, you know, movies like I'm seeing on in theaters and just started just like playing around with the with it and making movies with my friends and just fell in love with the process. And I think a lot of it was just me trying to just scare my sister, just make things that that scare her, which was fun. Have you always been attracted to scary movies?

You can be super creative with them. And it's always like a fun place to experience fears that you have without actually being in danger. So if you're ever in that situation, you kind of hopefully can not freeze up because you've got to experience them on screen. So that's why I love horror and scary movies. Tess, what's your background?

I started actually in dinner theater. My family owned one. And I got thrown in as a baby, basically. And then I grew up in theater. and found a really great community in theater. And then I fell in love with film around high school and just tried it and trying different things.

I come from a big musical background and dance and acting and all that. So I like to try different things. So I tried film and I went, wait a minute, I'm kind of introverted and I really love this and I can be a I fell in love with film and then I just, I moved to Atlanta in 2018 and started pursuing that professionally. So that's where I come from. Kimberly, how about yourself?

My goodness. I'm like a black sheep here. I was in marketing and advertising for 10 years. We'd always wanted to try this. And then I moved to a new city and I was like, I kind of need to make friends.

Where could I go? So I went to community theater. And fell in love with that. And like Tess said, the community of fear is just great. And then wanted to challenge myself.

And I tried TV and film and realized takes are wonderful. Not that we need many. And yeah, I just, I absolutely fell in love with being in front of a camera and being minimal. Yeah, so only a few years, probably COVID. COVID is what started that journey when we moved.

And Josie, how about yourself? In terms of the. Performing arts world, I started more in the dance and skating category. So I was a competitive figure skater when I was six through middle school. And then I traded that in to become a dancer.

And I fell in love with dancing and being on stage. I love performing in front of a live audience. So from there, I kind of transitioned into doing musical theater. And I actually graduated high school class of 2020 when COVID hit and I was going to get my BFA in college. But the project, not the project, the program actually transferred to online schooling due to the nature of COVID.

And I didn't want to get a musical theater degree in my bedroom. So I took a gap year and started to really seriously study. pursue TV and film since I'd already had an agent and I fell in love with it more than any other art that I'd ever explored. And then I met these crazy folks a couple years later and we made a cool witch movie. Frank, I know you tend to direct stuff that you've written. Can you tell me how you came across the script for this?

I directed a movie called Siren several years back, which was an adaptation of a VHS segment called Amateur Night, that David Brugner did. And Piotrowski and Ben Collins wrote that feature, and we just thought they were super talented writers. And then so once we finished that movie, we were like, oh, what can we do next? And they had an old script called Red Hands, which had the same witch mythology, but it was more like witches attacking a cabin in the woods. And I was like, okay, the cabin in the woods thing, I don't really...

I don't feel inclined to make a Cabin in the Woods movie. I feel like it's been done so many times and so well. But I was like, there's something interesting if we set this during Halloween and had a more suburban feel. And they came up with the idea of a renegade witch that it's separated from. It was almost like, in a weird way, a sequel to that script.

And I was like, now this I'm down with. And we started developing it together. And it took 10 years of just kind of taking it around. And we kind of got rejected from every studio and then we like reworked it and changed the title and then got rejected again. And then finally we had a couple of like, we almost made it a couple of times, three times it almost went.

And then, yeah, this, I guess this time was, uh, it was meant to be with this like right group of people in the right cast and the right, everything. I felt like it just, the planets had the line a little bit and it's almost like the, I feel like everything was just kind of waiting for this right, the right ingredients for this movie to, you know, to be what it is. Was there any sort of like extra pics, pixie dust or anything you had to put in there to really actually get the green light for this? I did a concept trailer. So I shot a little bit and then use some like CGI and did some like, you know, some new technology just to like, here's what the movie is going to be.

So I could like say, here's a, 30-second trailer, and this is what it's going to look like, this is what it's going to be, and I feel like that helped kind of catapult it to getting actualized. Because then you can look at it and be like, oh, I see what this movie is, I see what it's going to look like, I see what it's going to be. I mean, with Cabin in the Woods movies, you usually have like four people in the cabin, one, two, maybe a group of zombies outside attacking you've got a lot of people in this movie and you know, you've got some very, very talented actors and actresses here. And I'm curious, how did you kind of bring this all together? I'd worked with a casting director.

His name's Jonathan Spencer. And I worked with him on a movie. I did a while back called dance of the dead. And he was just, he's unlike any other casting director I've ever worked with. And that he'll just like, he won't, he's just relentless.

He won't stop. And he just keep giving me options. I'm like, I know we're not finding this person. And he'll just like, keep like dig deeper and, find people and you know and he's just by the end of this we had an amazing pool of actors that then it was just like these are all great actors now it's just like what is the best combination of people for this role what's the best ensemble and it was it ended up being these fine folks you see in front of. You yes can you tell me how do you approach a character like the one that you played i have to say before we started recording i did give you a compliment because you are Super scary in the movie, and it's nice to see you not as scary.

Thank you. That's the best compliment anyone could ever give me in this movie, is to be terrifying. Now, I wanted to approach this character, I. Didn't want to be your typical villain. You see who's ragey and will just lose it at any moment.

I wanted her to feel more contained until the right time. In the script that Luke Piotrowski and Ben Collins wrote, they really wrote something that was so well thought out. And the arcs were there and the climax was there for Nev. And I was just so grateful that Luke was on set with us that I could bounce ideas off of him and try to pick his brain a lot during the wee hours of the night when he wasn't asleep. So anyway, when I approached this character, I wanted her to have this innocence to her.

But also, like you said, terrifying. I love to pull ideas off of, you know, things that I've seen, things that I've watched, but also I wanted to create a whole character that was original to me. The voice just kind of came to me and it stuck. And I did workshop a couple versions of it with Greg and I said, is the voice working? Are we digging this?

Voice and he did love it and so I I was so thankful for that because I mean. When it's vulnerable to put yourself out there like that and to make creative choices and just hope for the best and it was truly so collaborative in this movie I mean it feels. Like there were a lot A lot of night shoots. And I'm curious, Kimberly, how was that for you? And like, did you find yourself losing your mind just because you're shooting at night so often?

It was an adjustment. Definitely an adjustment. I think what we had like 26 or something all in all with five days on, two days off. And it. Didn't really bother me.

Once we started doing it, it kind of just became normal. Like nurses, right? They changed their schedules from day to night, so had to find out what tricks worked. Lots of Alani's on set. Snacks.

Everyone was so. Excited to be there that even when we were tired, we were picking each other up and rolling through, literally rolling through tape. So it ended up being fun. I liked the night shoots. We also got to bond really well because, you know, there's nothing to go do during the day if you have downtime.

And we had to hang out with one another and all fall asleep on each other and then just get right back into it. So it was a challenge in the best way. Josie, what was your experience making this one? Oh, my goodness. To confine it into such small words, I don't know if I'll be able to.

It was genuinely the most, I think, special experience I've ever had on a set. We had such a unique group because from the cast to the crew, everyone got along so well. Everybody loved each other so well and respected the living heck out of each other, which just made it so incredibly fun. Greg, I think, set us up for success from the beginning because before we even started rolling, we had two weeks of rehearsals before we started shooting. And for me, that was really beneficial on set because I have a lot of scenes with our child actors, Ava Mae and Luke Speakman.

And I really wanted to ensure I developed those relationships before we started rolling because that was organic on camera and on screen. And getting that time with them before we started shooting was invaluable. And I hope it shows on screen. I love them. Those are my children now.

And I think once we just started shooting throughout the 26 days, as Kimberly said, it was so nonstop and so go-go, but everybody was always on their game. So it never really felt... There's never a dull moment. We were always moving along and picking each other up and having so much fun doing it. I have nothing but incredible things to say.

Greg, what was probably the most challenging thing for you on this film? It was the said two kid actors were just the scheduling around them. They were both wonderful actors, but they were 12 when we shot the movie. And there's just labor laws that they can only be on set for a certain amount of time. And like you said, our whole movie takes place at night.

So they also have curfews. So we have less time with them. So it was a, it was just that two weeks before we shot was really about how do we get their coverage in and then, you know, stage everything so that we can, you know, get through the scenes. So a lot of it was using doubles, you know, for when we're turned around on the other actors, it was a, of a, challenging puzzle to figure out how to get the movie to can but i do i knew it was like there's always the conversation too of like we should age up the kids that's the first thing that kind of the producers say like yeah just get them a certain age i think it's 16 then you have more time with them and stuff but i was like you know there's something special about one those two actors and just that age that is unique to especially this movie and to you don't see it very often and films at this level because it's just a big pain in the butt to try and work around.

But I thought it was worth fighting for. And it's kind of production value of just having like two awesome kids that can, you know, that are really, really strong actors in the movie. But yeah, that's definitely our most challenging thing. Did you find that the witches and the mortals were in their own camps? Like, would they hang out with each other?

Well, I tried to get that going. I tried to be like, okay, Ty, you can't talk to the kids. I want you to be kind of like standoffish. But everyone just loves each other so much. Everyone got along so well that after the first couple of days, I was like, well, that was a good idea that just went away because everyone just got along so good.

How long? Ladies, were you in makeup for this? Because there's a lot of really incredible makeup effects that go on in this. And I can only imagine that some of it had to take a long time. At first, I think we were wondering how we were going to do the hand prints.

And we were very fortunate that our very talented makeup artist, Tati, we have the same size hand. So it ended up working brilliantly. And that was always the last element before going on set. I gave Tati and our hair tea. They were incredible.

They were just rolling us in and out of that makeup room and hair and wardrobe. Eventually a shed, I think we had. And they, it was just boom, boom. Boom, boom, boom. And we got into the routine of it.

So I think in the beginning it took a little bit longer, but once we knew what we were doing, we would just let it flow rather quickly. That's about yourself, because you have a very distinct look. In this call. Yeah, the team, I mean, killed it with our looks. The hair was all Vaseline, and it was all Vaseline all day, every day, and teasing.

There was also talks at one point that I was going to have red hair, actually. I decided not to. But also, the costume, it just clashed, and... It was almost too much red, I feel. And I'm so glad that I got to have my own hair for this because it kind of brought even more innocence to the character that it needed.

Creepy innocence is, you know, little kid blondes. No offense to little kid blondes, but you're creepy as hell. Well, you make a very striking image when you are on screen at the beginning. It's just like, wow, who is this? What is happening here?

And then just the evil that you do is pretty terrific. And yeah, just the look of so many of these characters. There's one sequence during the beginning when we see the maybe end of act one kind of thing where there's two witches that are saying the same spell at the same time and one has dark hair the other has light hair and it's just such a great contrast and that's kind of why I'm focusing on the hair and makeup so much because you get a lot of mileage out of that. Yeah yeah I think right after I the first draft of the script that I read I just I have an art background so the first thing I did is I gotta draw these witches and so I just kind of sketched out like what I think they should look like and then handed those over to makeup and hand those over to our awesome costume designer, Miracle Burns and Chris Burns.

And they just kind of took those ideas and then just kind of ran with it and embellished them and made them their own. And yeah, I'm very proud of all the looks of the witches. They're very cool to me. And your instinct about setting this in suburbia is really a smart one just because it's so much scarier that this is happening with the neighbors at home kind of thing versus out there in a cabin in the woods. Right.

I mean, how often do you go to Cabin in the Woods? Not very often, sometimes, but you're at home a lot more than you are at Cabin in the Woods. And we ended up shooting like five minutes from the house I grew up in. So all the scenes of the kids trick-or-treating are literally the same roads that I, neighborhoods I would trick-or-treat in when I was a kid. So it was very nostalgic for me.

I bet. Yeah, I was going to ask where it was shot. And did you use sets at all or was it all shot in that house? All practical. Yeah, everything is the house.

Yeah, everything was just real locations. Which I love that, you know, unless you have a crazy big budget, just kind of recreating things like that or it's difficult. But always, even if think if we had an enormous budget, I feel like I do like being in real locations. And it just kind of grounds it. You can feel a history in the house too.

You know, you can feel like, it feels like very lived in. It feels like as we're searching for houses, I was like, I just wanted to look like a house that people actually live in. You know, it was like, you'd see the notches on the wall from where like they were, you know, the kids grew up and they're doing their height. You know, you just, I don't know. It just felt tactile, felt real.

Playing onto that with the practical effects and the set dressings, I remember when we saw where the witches live in the woods for the first time, and that was the most incredible thing because all of that, it was real tangible items and they put it together so beautifully that it just enhanced the experience of playing pretend in this imagine. world that happened to be real. Josie, have you worked with many special effects in your career? This was the first project where it was really a front, a very front and center part of the film, which was so cool. I think it also pushed me as an actor to really use my imagination in each scene because you know for example there's a scene where some characters are learning how to do magic and you know you're staring at something supposed you know you're supposed to see a spell or sparks or whatever it may be and you're just reacting off of whatever your brain thinks it should look like in the moment right and then getting the experience of seeing it in the theater with everybody at Fantastic Fest where we premiered and how beautifully Greg and the team put it all together It was so surreal.

So I was like, oh, that's even better than how I imagined it on set. So it was one of the first times it was very front and center for me. But it was so cool to be pushed and to grow in that regard. And I absolutely loved everything about it. Well, yeah.

Tell me about that screening at Fantastic Fest. How was that? Was that your first time seeing it? It was. It was all of our first times seeing it.

Greg. I tried every single day to get like a trailer, a teaser, a something. And Greg stood his ground and said no. But to his credit, I'm so glad he did. Because I actually sat in between these two lovely ladies.

I had Tess and Kimmy on both sides of me. And we were just grabbing each other's hands and smiling and applauding each other's performances. Because it's one thing to, I think, be in the scene. It's another thing to watch it. Especially for me, I was in the house a lot with the kids and with Kai, so I didn't get to see a lot of Tess's work.

I didn't get to see a lot of the witch's work. And getting to see what they were doing while I was, you know, in the hair and makeup room, it was so surreal. And just honestly incredible to see it all come together in front of me with everybody around. Yeah, Tess, what was your experience? Oh, it was so cool.

It was so cool to see. Actually, all of my scenes were outside. And seeing them do everything inside of the house, I was like, wow, this is a really good story. I was, and everybody just nailed it. I mean, it just, it all really came together and it was so beautiful.

Being out in the cold was worth it. Our amazing costumers had layers and layers and layers and thankfully pockets and amazing Amazing wardrobe for us to make sure we were safe and good. Oh, and there are a few scenes where I'm barefoot and they actually made these creepy, weird little flesh colored shoes for me so that I didn't have to be barefoot in the wide shots as well. And so just every detail was thought of and it was really cool. You're like a hobbit.

Yeah, I did. I felt like a hobbit. Kimberly, was this your first time at Fantastic Fest? It was. And the whole experience was just so magic, especially getting to see our film for the first time there.

It's an honor to have that as a world premiere, right? It's such a well-known genre festival that I think we're so proud of what we all made and we were so excited for each other that this was kind of the cherry on top for us as the first. And the community at Fantastic Fest, they're great. It's wonderfully run. Everyone there is so helpful and everyone's so excited because you know, we all have the same interests.

We like horror films. Some people like hurting kids. We're in a special category called Children in Peril. So you can like click on it and be like, oh, if you want your Children in Peril movies, you click on it. It's us.

I think it was us in another movie. What's next for y'all and for the movie? We're playing at. Stitches, which is fun, and Spain. So that'll be our next, that's our next big screening.

So very excited. They're also just a great, crowd of just movie-loving folks that I. Can't wait to show them the movie. Do you have your next project lined up? I have scripts, and I have some stuff I'm writing, too.

So I don't know which one it'll be, but there's movies that I want to make. Yeah, Tess, what is next for you? I'm so excited for Stitches. I think this movie could go all the way, baby. I'm so excited.

I also, I'm just auditioning and I'm filming commercials and just working my way up, baby. So really fun. I'm also developing a script right now. It's in the beginning stages, but keep creating. Is there a good place for people to keep up with you and your work?

Yes, of course. You can follow me on Instagram, Tess.Williams. The S is actually a Z at the end. So yeah, that's my Insta. Kimberly, how about yourself?

Do you have something lined up? I would love to go to Spain and see this at Sitges. Like Tess, just trying to keep busy, trying to stay creative. I actually just submitted an audition about 15 seconds before jumping onto this call. So auditioning and being in.

Class, I think that's really important. And I love class. You're not learning, you're not growing. And then what's the point? How about you?

Are you on the socials? Yeah, it's... I'm not on TikTok. Come at me. But Instagram is.

You're not doing any dances on TikTok? No, I kept getting left out of them on set, ladies. So my Instagram is at Kimmy, K-I-M-M-I underscore isms, I-S-M-S. And according to my parents, that's the stupid shit I say and do. Josie, how about you?

What's next for you? Yeah, I mean, I'm very excited for this thing to go to Spain and for it to reach another audience. I'm really excited and pumped about that. I have another movie coming out in 2027 called Before Daylight. It's a modern adaption of a J.M.

Barrie novel. So I'm very excited for that to come out. Besides that, the same as these lovely folks, I'm auditioning and working on my craft. I'm in classes and my partner and I are actually developing our own screenplay. So that has been very fun to collaborate on.

I am on Instagram and the TikTok. You can find me. It's both the same. It's Josie, J-O-S-I-E, Juliette, J-U-L-I-E-T-T-E, W-E-R-T-E. I don't have any of the fun stuff that they have, like Zs and Isms.

I wish. I'm boring. Well, I hear that people figured out to use their own name after a while because I was just told that the other day. I didn't realize that. If you're newer on Instagram, you use your name because it's harder to figure out your handle if you've got weird names.

I used to be Skullcrusher3000. com. For the longest time, from the time I was 10 to the time I was like 20, a man actually messaged me and bought it. Off of me. Wow. There you go.

All right. I mean, it was like $ 10. Hey, $ 10 is $ 10. And I regret it every day. It's so fitting for your character, too.

That would have been great PR for the movie. Curse that guy. I know. And Greg, finally, how about yourself for the film? There is an official Instagram.

Guys, what is Instagram? It's the heretics.official. And I'm at a Bishop Greg. So it's B-I-S-H-O-P-G-R-E-G-G. And that's heretics with a K, correct?

Heretics with a K. You got it. Well, thank you, everybody, for your time today. This was so nice talking with you. And I really enjoyed Heretics.

Thank you so much for making this film and just having... Such a fun horror film out there. I mean, fun and scary. So thank you so much. Thank you.

Thank you, Mike. Yeah, Mike, these were really great questions as well. Thank you. Yeah, I'm out. Music Music Music Turn out the crowd 101 We'll be right back.

We'll be right back. to the dying secret till the last words are told Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.